Behler Blog has a great post on layers in story telling and where/what/when plot begins. While I’m a fan of a spare story telling style, I really believe that whether a writer tells their story with an economy of words or creates a lush verbal landscape, I’ve always been a big fan of layers in what I read and write and in storytelling in general.
So as I struggle with outlining my plot I wondered about some things. Are your layers like your characters? I mean, characters sometimes jump up and demand that you do something totally different than what you had planned. Do you have all the layers in your story in hand or in your mind when you start writing, or do your layers develop as you go deeper into your character’s heads and your plot-lines?
I think I get layers as I get deeper involved with my characters. They seem to add their own complications as I write so I have to take my cues from them.
ReplyDeleteThis happened in my last book too, I got to around chapter 5 and things started evolving that I hadn't anticipated, some of which I never even knew about until I started revising.
My layers definitely develop as I write the story. I know generally what I want to create, but once I start writing all these new elements occur. It's one of my favourite parts of writing--the unexpected.
ReplyDeleteMy layers develop. I once read a book about plot lines/character that said outline everything your character likes/dislikes/etc/etc/etc. Basically it said "don't write until you figure out everythihng about every character". Gah! I can't do that. Most of my character qurks and such come after-the-fact. In the moment type this. Granted, I know if they are nice, mean, sarcastic, alpha, etc, but specific layers develop as I write. I couldn't imagine doing it any other way.
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I do outline, developing the characters to an extent that way. But it's a fluid outline, changing and growing as I go. The second draft will also bring about changes in development, things I see once the whole story is in place.
ReplyDeleteI get an idea for a plot, then the characters and their pasts develop in my mind, and once I know them inside and out, I start writing my story, offering bits of background throughout the MS.
ReplyDeleteI would say ... both. Some layers I create as I'm worldbuilding and doing character references, and others occur as I'm writing. I rarely outline - when I do, it's loose outlines when I have multiple plotlines, usually when I'm already in the middle of writing. This makes sure they don't run at different paces and intersect properly.
ReplyDeleteMy layers come as I write. Often I start a character thinking they are for one purpose and find out they were hiding something much bigger.
ReplyDeleteI'd say both. In my wip, my layers have come from other things beyond the characterization, including symbolisms and imagery. Though, I guess, in the end, it all stems from my mc.
ReplyDeleteGreat post. At the SCBWI annual conference in LA last year, the common thing I heard was that editors are looking for stories with layers.
I like the question.
ReplyDeleteI have a pretty good sense of where I'm going, but my characters are pretty bossy - especially the protagonist. But when I'm done, I take back some control.
Although I do plot my stories, the layering usually develops as it goes along. I like layering - it makes the story so much more interesting, at least I think so! Sometimes layers conspire to send me off on a tangent - I have to keep an eye on them to make sure they still fit the original story.
ReplyDeleteMy characters definitely develop as I write. I'm not one who starts with an outline and a full character sketch before I start writing.
ReplyDeleteNo no no.
They surprise me.
That's just the way I write.
Mine develop as I go. For instance, my main protag in the WIP started out as a cop, then became a brother, then a telepath, then an OCD guy with issues about vulnerability and relationships... yeah. I found out all that about him as I was writing him. Just the way my brain works, I guess.
ReplyDeleteSometimes, but I try to keep them contained, otherwise things become too loose.
ReplyDeleteAnne, I think you’re right. Characters add layers we never even think of in the beginning.
ReplyDeleteJade, I hear you there. I love the process.
Justine, I’m right there with you. I’ve seen the books and directions about outlining everything and have the same reaction as you. And, like you, I’m an after the fact writer, and I can’t imagine doing it any other way. I guess that means I’m a hopeless pantser.
Joanne, fluid sounds like a great idea. And like you, I do a lot of revising the second time through.
Christi, yep. Plot drives character drives plot. And I’m a big fan of bits and pieces and clues interwoven throughout the story.
Lindsey, it sounds like you have a great system that works really well for you. Congrats!
Tara, hee! I love when characters hide stuff for you. It’s almost like Christmas.
Stina, exactly. Layers can/do come from things beyond character. I’m a big fan of imagery in writing and I love reading/writing it. I’m glad editors are looking for layers. It makes for better books.
Theresa, thanks. You’re right. It’s important to have a sense of where you’re going and to let your characters do their thing. But it’s also important to be the one ultimately in control. It’s a fine line.
ReplyDeleteJayne, I agree. Layering makes the story. I’m not a fan of plastic or cardboard cutout characters or formulaic, simplistic, by the numbers plot. And you’re right, you do have to keep track of all the layers and their points of intersection.
Yvonne, hee! No. No. No. Yep, I’m with you on the whole develop as I write thing. It’s me.
Hi, B. Very cool, how your brain works. And it’s great how your character unfolded his secrets to you as you wrote him.
Bane, you’re right. Too loose is not a good thing. :)
Layers come as I write, although I try to keep things fairly simple. The characters grow and even though I've already outlined the plot, it gets meatier.
ReplyDeleteI enjoyed reading all the comments.
ReplyDeleteMy characters, the story, the plots and subplots all reveal themselves as I type my first draft.
In subsequent drafts I often add more layers (and delete some).
Happy Thursday, SJS...Smile!
Do the elemental ways of advancing characterization help to initiate those layers: actions, narration, what other characters say,direct description, and dialogue? I also think how characters interact with their setting is important.
ReplyDeletei think layering up, for me anyway, really gets its push in the revision stage. There's usually some hints in the first draft, but they need to be coaxed out.
ReplyDeleteI'm with a lot of the others here that I start out with a pretty decent idea of the plot, but the layers really develop when I'm already in the midst of the story.
ReplyDeleteMy characters come to me in disguise. Just when I think I've got them figured out, they change on me. AND they are Bossy. Hummmm....
ReplyDeleteI start with an outline, but like my characters, my layers do sometimes go a different direction than I had planned. Usually I think this happens because I'll realize something I thought would make sense doesn't really jibe anymore now that the story's taken more shape. I love layers, too - reading them and writing them, I think they make the story much more interesting.
ReplyDeleteTalli, simple is good. As is character growth. :)
ReplyDeleteLola, very cool. You make is sound so easy. I love it. And I’m jealous. :) Happy Thursday to you, too.
Paul, yes, exactly. It’s all interwoven. And I think setting is especially important as a character in its own right. We’ve had some really interesting discussions about that around here.
Falen, yep. If you’ve done the work and set up for it in your first draft, it should really come out in your second.
Shelley, I think that’s where a lot of us find things really taking off in terms of layering.
Betty, hee! I love the idea of them coming to you in disguise. And yes. They are bossy. :)
I often wonder how authors create all of these layers of depth in their characters and story lines. I try, but sometimes it seems like I try to hard. I love layering though and I love to read authors who layer well--intentionally or by accident. :)
ReplyDeleteThis is interesting. I have learnt so much with reading blogs. :o)
ReplyDeleteI enjoy layered stories as well. The major events in my book are all outlined, but the little connections and subplots and character interactions come from the moment. I'm always stunned with what comes. I try to add layers to my characters by writing their backgrounds - even minor ones - I want to know a little bit of their history. After I finish my first draft I will go back and add layers to the scenery and the history of where they live.
ReplyDeleteOh I'm all about layers. My characters and plots get so complicated, sometimes overly so. But I don't start out that way. It's only as I get to know them better that everything gets crazy wild. Like, I'll start out with two people who love each other and then all of a sudden there's a bit of conflict, like maybe one of them has a crazy mom who doesn't want them together, and then you find out that the mom actually does want them together, but her husband will disinherit her son if he marries the poor girl, and then you discover that the poor girl is actually in a secret relationship with the dad because the dad is paying her college tuition and she just didn't know better because her father abandoned her when she was ten to move in with his mistress, and she hadn't planned on falling in love with her lover's son, especially because he was such a bad boy, rebelling against his dad, and so she thought he was just trying to get with her to make his dad mad, and that is the truth actually, but he fell in love with her by accident, so she starts to wonder after a while if he actually loves her or just the idea of ticking off his dad and then you find out that the two of them are actually brother and sister...wait, scratch the last part.
ReplyDeleteBut yeah, go deep deep deep. :)
I have the layers in mind when writing but I think they'll really come out during the finishing process.
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ReplyDeleteA lot of my layers and twists are folded in as I edit, version by version. It's an interesting insight about how the most intricate plots are built!
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